|
This is the unedited transcript of the morning session of the Palestine solidarity trade union conference on 18 April in Liverpool Steve Farley: Good morning colleagues, and welcome to the conference today, the Palestine solidarity trade union conference. My name is Steve Farley, I’m the chair of the North-West TUC, and also the Regional Secretary of the Public and Commercial Services Union, which is affiliated to the PSC as well. We’ve got a fairly tight packed morning session I think. We’ve rejigged the agenda because one of the speakers missed the train from London and we may have to juggle round a little bit. There are time limits and the most strict one I think is, at 12:30 there will be the COSATU telephone call, we must take that at that time, so I may have to curtail some debate and some questions during the morning, in order to make sure we meet that particular deadline. Before I introduce the speakers, I don’t want to take up any time with boring speeches by me, because that’s not why we’re here, but I was thinking when John Bowman asked me to chair the opening session of this, what sort of remarks I could come up with and what did I think about. And one of the things that I’ve been thinking about in the long time that I’ve been aware of the Palestinian struggle for self-determination, I think one of the things that strikes me is the hypocrisy of Western governments. I think whatever the Palestinian people do, it’s still not good enough for most of the Western governments. And I’m reminded of instances where, particularly America, when Chile elected a left-wing government, and I think it was Henry Kissinger who said “do you think we’re going to sit by while the Chilean people are stupid enough to elect a bunch of communists”? So obviously representative democracy is only ok provided the right people get elected. I think the same is true for the Palestinian people, that when we forced them to embrace a form of democracy that may not be what they want, it may well be, that’s up to them to decide, but if they then return the wrong people in the election, it’s saying “no you’ve got that wrong, so we don’t want you to do that any more”. And that hypocrisy doesn’t just apply to Palestine, but it also applies to places like Cuba, like Venezuela. Ironically it doesn’t extend to Communist China, and there’s probably a reason for that, I suppose, and I’m sure that Western governments can explain why Communist China is ok, but any sort of Marxist government in South America is totally unacceptable. But the struggle of the Palestinian people is one that’s not only galvanised political thought, galvanised workers around the world, but it’s also one of the saddest, the most shameful episodes that we’ve witnessed throughout the 20th and 21st century. I am really pleased to welcome Manawel Abdel-Al from the Palestinian General Federation of Trade Unions, and he’s also on the Palestinian national Boycott Committee, the organisation in Palestine which is seeking to promote and establish the international boycott of Israeli goods throughout the world. He lives in Jerusalem. And he’s also over here not just to speak to us today, we’re very privileged to have him here this morning, but he’ll be going on to the Scottish TUC to speak there later in the week as well. So can I without further ado introduce Manawel, and hopefully you can give him the warm welcome that we know he deserves. [applause] Manawel: Good morning for everybody. [in Arabic] Muhammad Ghannam: Good morning to everybody, he’s sending his apologies to everybody that he can’t speak English well so he would be speaking in Arabic and he’s happy to be here with you. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: He started by thanking everybody who participated in making this event easy for him, and the big effort made in order to bring him here to speak to you about parts and bits of the suffering of the Palestinian people in Palestine. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: If he was to speak about everything it would take forever, so he’s going to concentrate on a few points that in his opinion would be beneficial for this meeting. First about the PGFTU, which is the Palestinian General Federation of Trade Unions, and he’s going to start speaking about the conference of the Congress of the PGFTU which happened in July last year. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: In that conference, 25 members were elected as an Executive Committee, among them there was a guaranteed quota of 4 for the women delegates, so 4 of the 25 Executive Committee are women, and in that conference they set the policy of dealing with the Histadrut, which is the Israeli trade union. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: As he came from Jerusalem, and from the part of Jerusalem which was occupied since 1967, which is East Jerusalem, he’s going to speak to you about a few points which make it a kind of a unique city in the whole world. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: First of all, there is, for the working people there, there are 3 laws which get implemented upon them, three labour laws. First, for the working people who are working in Jerusalem, and everybody who is working there, there is 3 laws which is implemented on them. First one is the Jordanian law, which was implemented before 1967, Jerusalem being under Jordanian authority. Second, the Israelian law, which Israel tries always to force on Jerusalem, considering Jerusalem to be part of Israel. And the third one is the Palestinian labour law which is started by the Palestinian Authority when they came in 1994. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: That causes problems, for example if any working man or woman has been subject to any sort of problem, they have as trade unions to combine between 3 laws in order to solve their problem. And with any problem when they try to force the Israelian laws on them, the trade unions in Jerusalem, they refuse to go to the Israelian courts, because they consider that it’s illegal that Jerusalem is under the Israelian laws as an occupied city. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I’m sure that a lot of you are aware of this, being trade unionists as I imagine, that it’s a unique situation in the world, having 3 labour laws being implemented on any working person in any city of the world. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: After that I’m going to speak to you about the workers situation in Palestine, starting with the unemployment. In Gaza the unemployment reached the figure 50%. In the West Bank, it’s about 20 – 25%. And if we take into consideration the international unemployment it will reach the figure of 33% which is 20% in the West Bank and 50% in Gaza. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: In Gaza Strip it’s 70 – 80% of people who are living under the poverty line, according to the Palestinian survey dept.(?) Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: That situation has created a very desperate people, looking to work under any conditions, just to get a little to survive more. And there’s working men and women there who works for less than 5 dollars for a day. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: And I’m going to speak to you about the racist wall, apartheid wall, and the implications for the Palestinian people. In the areas where the Arab Palestinian people live, after building that Apartheid Wall. It started to prevent people from going to workplaces, preventing students from going to their schools, universities. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: And I want to speak about the effect of the Wall, considering that the highest number of hospitals existed in the area of East Jerusalem, and because of the apartheid wall as a separation between people who want to go to be treated in these hospitals which are concentrated in East Jerusalem. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: Imagine for these students, and particularly for the health workers who work in these hospitals, imagine that some of them have been working in these medical institutions for over 30 years, before the Occupation of 1967, imagine that when they go to their working places, that at the moment, if they go back and visit their families in the West Bank, in towns like Ramallah or Bethlehem or [?], they can’t come back to their workplace. So they stay in these places where they work, not being able to go and visit their families because of this wall. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: And one point I want to speak about as well, the recent news about the train authorities, who will not employ anybody who has not served in the Israelian army. And who doesn’t serve in the Israelian army, it’s just the Palestinians. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I want to speak about the organisation which is called OCHA, which part of the United Nations, and its recent report about the 600 checkpoints in the West Bank under different names. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: Their report which speaks about these different names for these checkpoints, from Iron Gates, military checkpoints, Border Control, sudden search points, and a kind of [? Wall] Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: At some of these points, they are still up to now closing the entrance for Palestinian towns and villages, and they are looking for other ways in order to find a way to these villages and towns. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: For all of this, with all of this stressful situation for the Palestinian workers, the working places and medical centres and hospitals, wherever they work, and for all this suffering for the Palestinian people, and their families, which if we speak about it we are not going to finish within the short time that we have, the big question is, what is wanted from us, as trade unionists involved with trade unions in Palestine, as international trade unions, from me, from you, everybody who is in a trade union movement, who I am specifically speaking to today, and everybody who is in international solidarity. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: What is wanted from everybody who is a trade unionist, to take it to their trade union organisation as members, the simplest thing that we can do, and as a trade unionist I will refuse to use the word “weapons”, but the simplest thing that is really needed to be done is to support the boycott and the boycott campaigns for all Israelian products and to boycott all the Israelian kind of policies, which it’s the same policies that is affecting all the Palestinians, this apartheid regime which is continuing to occupy and divide the Palestinian land and the Palestinian people and to oppress them, the simplest thing we can do, in my opinion – which is his opinion – the simplest thing is just supporting all the boycott campaigns that we can do. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: During the last war in Gaza, one happy news and supportive and a kind of a news that caused the Palestinians to be happy that there is somebody who is doing something about them, was the dockers trade union in South Africa, when they refused to take down the goods and the cargo from the Israelian ship which ended up going back to Palestine – to Haifa – and that has lifted the spirit of the Palestinians and the Palestinian trade unions and we sent a very strong thank you letter to the South African trade union of the dockers. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I don’t want to go on speaking about the hard situation in the Gaza Strip because we are waiting for his colleague Habeeb who is from Gaza – he’s here! – who will be able to talk to you and explain in detail the situation in Gaza Strip. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I want to talk to you about two specific companies. One of them which is called Veolia, because he heard the news that they are the favoured bidder to be work on treating the waste in the North-West and in Liverpool, and they have a bid to treat the solid waste or something, he wants to speak about that and another company called City Pass. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: That company Veolia, just to bring to your attention that it’s building a tram system in East Jerusalem, going in many Arabic areas and the only town that it will go directly inside of the town will be his own village, called Shofat, that’s where he lives himself. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: That tram system is designed to be built in order to connect the settlements in East Jerusalem and around Jerusalem, these settlements to be connected to Jerusalem city and West Jerusalem. And as you know, all the governments of the world and all the trade unions in the world, does not support that the area of East Jerusalem be under the Israeli, it considers it as an occupied territory by Israel. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: This company is advertising that it’s going to be serving the Arabic communities, which is a big lie. The only thing it’s doing is destruction to the environment and the economy, the Arabic economy, particularly in my village, which is about 4 km from Jerusalem. This tram will serve no Arab, no Palestinian, it will be just for to serve the settlers, the settlements and West Jerusalem. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I’m going to end before receiving your questions by repeating and stressing on the boycott. I urge all of you, this is something within your hands to work on it and stress on it, and something can be done. Something is to go strong on the question of the boycott campaign, by cutting the Israelian goods and Israelian institutions. Thanks a lot. [applause] Steve Farley: Manawel thank you very much for that. Colleagues can we open it up for questions. We need to keep it to about 10 minutes with a number of speakers to get in and the phone call at 12:30. Can we ask for questions as well, I know that people might want to make statements but we’ve only got 10 minutes. And can I just ask Sam who’s at the door to just make a brief statement, and then I’ll take questions. Sam Semoff: Just very briefly, many of you will know that Liverpool is linked with a city in the West Bank called Bil’in. Bil’in has become well known internationally because every Friday they have a peaceful demonstration against the wall. Last year we sent 3 people from Liverpool on a fact finding tour or visit to Bil’in, to get information that we can use to develop the links. Last night we received very tragic news in that one of the people from Bil’in was killed in a demonstration. We think that the person killed may have actually hosted the 3 people who visited from Liverpool, and we’re trying to confirm that now. If anybody’s interested in the Bil’in link we have a stall out here. Steve Farley: Thanks Sam. Can I move to questions straight away. Linda Clair: Can I just ask for comments on my concern that we should be treating the Histadrut as part of the Israeli state and the occupation, and that we should be urging all trade unions in this country to break all links with the Histadrut. I want him to confirm it so that nobody is under any misapprehension about it, we boycott the Histadrut directly. Muhammad: [in Arabic] Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I have no hesitation in supporting exactly and repeating all the request you made. [applause] Muhammad: you have all our support for this issue. And to be clear with you, I want to highlight one issue, that we as the PGFTU, the Palestinian General Federation of Trade Unions, we had an agreement with the Histadrut. That agreement was in order to get the money back for the Palestinian workers which had been taken off illegally by the Histadrut, without the right, but we had an agreement with them in order to get this money back for the Palestinians who work in Palestine. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: [in Arabic] Muhammad: I want to repeat, to say to you, what made it clear that your request needs the support of everybody, is the Histadrut’s position in the last war in Gaza, and the announcement which they produced during the war on Gaza, which kind of tried to defend the Histadrut, but they were part of this, and they supported the war on Gaza. And I just want to highlight to you that the Histadrut produced from its members, the one who was the head of the war on Lebanon, Amir Peretz, he was the head of the Histadrut. And you know the question of the agreement, which had been made between, the Palestinian workers, they have kind of a special situation, they wanted to get money which is right for these Palestinian workers, been taken from them by this Histadrut, in order for that, they wanted to get it back. It’s like any other thing, they need to deal with these Israelian organisations. Rica Bird: Just for information, there’s some information outside about Kav La’Oved, the Workers Hotline, who’ve got some research information specifically about the social security difficulties for the Palestinian workers, and the website information is outside. X: I work in a supermarket, Sainsbury’s. You know the herbs, it says West Bank, they try to deceive the customers to make them think it’s Palestinian herbs but really they’re grown on illegal Israeli settlements, and also the new potatoes, they hide the ticket where it says Israel, to make it look like they’re British potatoes. They hide the tickets of the loose potatoes from Israel, to deceive the customers. Where it says West Bank, it tries to deceive the customers. Pia: I’m active in Unison in the health sector, but one of the things that I think I need is a little bit more knowledge of what’s going on in the political situation in the occupied areas and in Gaza, because I think that would help our solidarity action, so that people when we’re having to argue with people we can counter with the reality of what’s going on on the ground. So in particular I would like to know what the political conditions does the PGFTU operate on. For instance what’s the relationship with Hamas in Gaza, and what’s the relationship with the Palestinian Authority in the occupied areas. Because for instance we hear that some EU money got through to the Palestine Authority to pay public sector workers. Is that the reality on the ground, or is there something else going on? Muhammad: [in Arabic] Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: To explain the political situation and position of the PGFTU, I want to say that first of all we are still up to now, up to this moment, part of the PLO, the Palestine Liberation Organisation. So for example at the level of the leadership, we don’t have anybody from Hamas on the Executive Committee for example. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: As an organisation they are not part of the PGFTU. In my personal opinion, because they have some kind of trade union organisation for them, the Islamists, which has the name of the Islamic Trade Union, and his personal belief is, even before starting negotiation on having them on the committees and to be part of the PGFTU, the name of an Islamic Trade Union doesn’t go hand in hand with the trade union movement. His personal belief, even before starting negotiations they have to change the name, because a trade union doesn’t have to have a kind of ethnicity or any kind of [?], as even the name, he’s stressing on the name, before any other actions. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: That’s a good point in terms of the money that had been sent to the health sector. He has no information, his knowledge is that the money goes to the Palestinian Authority and the Ministry of Health, which under their responsibility goes the hospitals and those things. But there’s another part, which is the ITUC, an amount of money has been donated to support the families of the members and workers from the PGFTU, which is in an account up to now in Sweden, waiting for the right way and the facilities in order – it’s frozen, it’s in Sweden! – until they are able to send it to Gaza to support the families of these people who very much need it. Manawel: [in Arabic] Muhammad: Why it was frozen? There was an agreement that this money will be used to buy goods and help and support from the West Bank and send it to Gaza Strip, and it will be through the United Nations convoys to the Gaza Strip. Now the United Nations came up with the issue that at the current time, they will not be able to take anything from the West Bank to Gaza Strip, so because of that it’s been frozen and they will be looking for other ways in order to make use of the money. Steve Farley: Can we move on, colleagues, I’m conscious of time. There will be an opportunity at about 12:45 to come back to this, and there will be discussions later on. I want to take Sameh Habeeb first, who is a photojournalist with an eyewitness account of what went on in Gaza, and then Brian Campfield from NIPSA, and also the president of the Trades Council, and then Eamon McMahon from the ICTU. That’s a fairly tight timetable but I think it was important to give Manawel the opportunity and for you to ask him questions, it’s very rare that we get this direct opportunity. So Sameh if we hand over to you? Sameh Habeeb: yes [applause] Sameh: I see just a row of people that I’ve never met, because this is my first time to meet more people from the West Bank. We are not able, we are not allowed Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: Yes, and only here, in Britain, the reason, our troubles is uniting us. It’s my second time here in Liverpool to speak on the situation in the Gaza Strip, I’ve got 15 minutes which is not enough at all, to speak about 3 years of siege and the last war. But I will try to recount and compress things to come out with something good, and I would love to address your eagerness to know about the political situation in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank. So I would try to get some more extra minutes but I will try to be 15. I’ll be speaking about the siege and about the war in Gaza and after the war, exactly. I just came out of Gaza Strip directly after the war, and I managed by a miracle to get out of Gaza. I am 23 years old, my name is Sameh Habeeb, I’m a journalist and a humanitarian in the Gaza Strip. I gave up everything and came out to England to speak with the PSC, I have toured most of the cities here, more the English people themselves. When I came into the country, I was denied by your government first, and then I applied and applied and I got the visa, and then when I tried to leave Gaza, I had not managed successfully to go out quickly, but after a time I have left Gaza and I’m here. And the problem, I don’t know how to get back to Gaza. If I get back to Egypt, they will deport me back to the UK, and the UK will not accept me as a refugee. So I don’t know where to go after I finish, my visa is to be finished by August. I’m not speaking about my own problem, but I’m speaking about the people. It’s the story of the people. I managed to get my freedom but a million and a half are still trapped, experiencing the economics and mayhem imposed by the Israelis. The siege was imposed really now more than 3 years. The siege was imposed 3 years ago and it’s the basis of the total collapse now, including the health sector, the industrial sector, the agricultural sector, construction, infrastructure, crossings, transport. These things and many other things are destroyed in the Gaza Strip. Health sector, when I came I have written this number but now this number 370 people killed, sentenced to slow death because Israel is not allowing to leave for treatment, and not allowing enough medications to get into the Gaza Strip, they are sentencing people to slow death. And imagine where a woman tries to leave and she has a cancer, and they tell her she is a security threat in Israel, a patient with a cancer is a security threat. The economy is totally collapsed. We don’t have an economy in the Gaza Strip at all. Most of our manufacturing systems, factories totally rely on Israel in terms of bringing the goods and raw materials. Luckily, maybe you are because you have a chance to pressure Israel and make this BIG campaign, with the PSC and other people, but in Gaza we are obliged to get their bullets, to get their shells, and we don’t have any choice because we would love to put this pressure, but we cannot. We have more than 4,000 factories totally stopped at the moment, not operating, in which thousands of people turn to be jobless, they don’t have any kind of income at the moment, and totally dependant on the UNRWA. The unemployment rate is more than 67% at the moment, and the poverty rate is more than 85% in the Gaza Strip, and the rest of the people do face severe troubles in getting their days. More than 1,100,000 of them totally rely on the UNRWA in getting their food supply. And the UNRWA itself is not finding easy access to its goods and humanitarian aid coming through, because you will notice the statement in my presentation that the UNRWA is always under the attack of the Israeli state. As for our imports and exports, we are not allowed to export our goods, but we are allowed to import their goods. For example the flowers, strawberries and other small products in the Gaza Strip, we are not allowed to export these things. And when we managed for example to export something of the flowers, at the end of the day the cartons, they are written Made in Israel. They steal even our goods, inside, when its in Gaza. The construction and infrastructure sector, for 3 years, a house is never built, a road is never built, a school is never built, a hospital is never built, nothing is being built, until this moment, and after the war we have more than 60,000 refugees, living in the mosques, in public places, and in camps, and Israel is not allowing at the moment the construction materials to enter the Gaza Strip, causing a big problem for these people, UNRWA is supplying food because some of them didn’t have an alternative, some of them went to live in the mosques. These mosques were hit already, so they want to leave them, because they have taken this mosque as a refuge, but they didn’t know that this mosque was hit. Spare parts not allowed for the water, fresh drinking water, so we have a big problem to drink water. More than 100,000 people do face big troubles in getting fresh drinking water. And sewage water is leaking into the Mediterranean because Israel is not allowing spare parts for the sewage system to get into the Gaza Strip, even they have destroyed some of these sewage water wells in time of war, and more than 77 million litres of sewage water is leaking into the Mediterranean, killing the fish resources destroying the sea. And the sea is something else. It’s not only killing fish, it’s also taking control of the whole Gaza shore. And now they’re bringing your troops, bringing the Nato, bringing the British troops, they’re already circulating in the sea off Gaza. The power blackout is still taking place in Gaza. Gaza has 3 main sources of power, one is from Egypt, one is from Israel, and one is our key power plant. This key power plant was hit in 2006 when the soldier who came to fight the Palestinians was captured by some Palestinian fighters. This was hit, and resulted in a big power shortage in the Gaza Strip, so we relied on electrical generators and the share we were getting from Israel. Israel tried to control the share we were getting, sometimes they give us power, sometimes they do not give us power, and Egypt, what we get from Egypt is not enough, we have troubles, so most of the Gaza Strip is facing big troubles in terms of power. Imagine a hospital with no power, imagine a school with no power, an institution, all these things cause severe trouble and we are still not able to deal with this trouble. For example, a hospital, the Shifa hospital in Gaza was in bad need, in time of war, because a power blackout hit most of the Gaza Strip. So the guys there tried to bring some of the fuel for the generators but they didn’t find fuel. So they were forced to take fuel from the ambulances to the generators. Fuel, they allow some tens of thousands of litres, and the others they do not allow. And the crossings, they were taking control of the fuel crossings, another crazy policy imposed on us. Crossings and fuel removing, this is something that we never experienced in the Gaza Strip. Freedom is a right that we have to practice, like other countries. But in Palestine, not just in Gaza but in West Bank, everywhere in Palestine we are not allowed to practice this freedom. And immediately they said that they have pulled out from the Gaza Strip and we gave you this freedom. I was on the BBC yesterday debating with an Israeli professor yesterday, and he said “you are sending rockets to Israel, you are killing our people, and we have pulled out.” And I told him how they have pulled out of Gaza. “You have taken some of the settlers from the inside of Gaza and you have encircled the Gaza Strip, you have destroyed the airport, the seaport, took control of the crossings, and the air, and nothing, there is no freedom they are speaking about”. They are trying to exaggerate by a policy of lies and propaganda against those poor people in Gaza. Israel has control of the 6 crossings, in which nothing gets in or out, except by their will. Even the goods that they are allowing, they are not allowing the quantity of aid to Gaza, in the normal time before the siege there was a need for more than 5 – 600 trucks of humanitarian aid, food and secondary things. But in time of siege, they started to decree this, and sometimes the crossings were totally closed, and then they allowed 15, 40, up to 150 maximum out of 600 trucks. So the price of the commodities went high, and people are not affording that, because they are jobless, hundreds of thousands of them are jobless at the moment. And there is a very ironic story of the goods getting into the Gaza Strip. When they didn’t allow the goods to get into the Gaza Strip, they gave them a kind of a choice. If you apply to have 10 trucks of flour, then you have to forget about 5 trucks of stationery, and this really happened and the UNRWA is a witness about that. People at the schools, last school year, because Israel is not allowing clothing or allowing stationery, they were asking and the UNRWA intervened, to allow clothing and to allow stationery, but didn’t, they said “we can send you some 10 trucks if you forget about some other 10 trucks from other committees”. The Gaza tunnels, why the Gaza tunnels? They have blockaded the borders, they have taken control of the crossings, they didn’t allow the goods. We were forced to dig the tunnels. We have more than 13,000(?) tunnels. It’s not for smuggling weapons. Maybe some of these tunnels are being used to smuggle weapons and it’s the right of the Palestinians to resist the occupation [applause] Most of those, most of them who work in the tunnels are well educated people, most of them got BA and Masters. More than 200 of those digging in the tunnels died through the attacks from Egypt, from Israel, and from other problems while digging into these tunnels. The war in Gaza, it wasn’t a war, but a genocide, an entire genocide against everything. There was a big psychological war, no shelters, no food, no water, no power, no fuel, no medicines, nothing in time of war in the Gaza Strip. And they have launched a psychological war from Day 1, in which they have dropped tens of thousands of leaflets. They have asked the people to leave the border areas to other areas but unfortunately they didn’t tell the people where to go, because the border is totally closed and the sea is totally controlled by the Navy forces, and the soldiers came into the Gaza Strip. So the people tried to flee inside the Gaza Strip. But they were hit and they were killed. And when they tried to kill some of the commanders of Hamas, they have killed many other people. When they have hit the Hamas Interior Minister, and as you know the assassination policy is even forbidden, it is not allowed, they have killed that guy, and they have killed more than 20 people with him, they have killed ... from Hamas, they have killed his family, the children and the people around him. If you are going to travel with him you are going to have the highest hi tech... They were targeting everybody. They are not targeting Hamas people as such, they have targeted all the people. Attacking the United Nations, they have attacked the United Nations with phosphorus bombs, they have killed the people, massacred the people, at Fakhoura school more than 45 people had fled their houses, destroyed houses in the North, to Jabalia. But they were destroyed and they were killed, more than 45, most of them women and children were killed in that school. And another school, I went to the story and made the story, was hit, 3 people were going to the toilet, 10 people were going to the toilet at midnight, they were hit by the drone and killed. The drones, by the way, it’s being supported by your government. Israel by the way, after they attacked the school, they have attacked the UNRWA. They were saying, Israel’s Foreign Minister was saying you do not have a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. But she did not speak about how it works in there. Because they were allowing 150 trucks a day in time of war, and not allowing the crossings to open totally as before the siege. And they have allowed some trucks but they have stored these trucks as you see in the UNRWA compound. This is a bag of flour burning in the UNRWA compound. They have destroyed hospitals, schools, everything. Ok, I’m trying to finish now, a small story. This guy had 3 children, female children, hit by the Israelis. Two of them were killed and the third is totally paralyzed, and his mother as well, when the paramedics tried to rescue him the ambulance was blown up. Samouni massacre, it was a family, it was a massacre in which more than 29 people were killed, they were calling on the radio stations, calling on the UNRWA, calling “please save us” while they were shelled by 3 shells, most of the people were killed and most of them who were sick they are still having some troubles. My last story, he fled to the school but he didn’t die there like some of his comrades. But when he went back to his area to bring some clothing and food he got hit by the drone in which he is totally blind and his brother was killed, his father was injured. And it’s not only humans. Others suffered from the Israelis. It’s cows. They have killed the cows. But it’s by snipers, it’s not by rockets. As you see, these cows were hit by the bullets. It’s not only about cows. They have massacred and destroyed a big farm of more than 60,000 chickens in the Gaza Strip. So they have destroyed the sea, by the sewage water, and they have killed the people of Gaza. They have killed the animals, they have killed the birds, they have killed everything, they have destroyed the schools. Thank you indeed for giving me this chance. [applause] Sameh: the questions will be after? Steve Farley: yes Brian Campfield: Thanks very much, I will be as brief as I can. I have a powerpoint presentation which was produced after the Irish Congress of Trade Unions delegation visited Palestine in November 2007. The presentation was designed to encourage activists to get involved in support of the Palestine cause. I don’t think we need to convince anybody here. But on one point, when we face arguments about the boycott, I think it’s very simple, when you listen to the last speaker, we’re witnessing the strangulation by Israel of everything Palestinian. The strangulation of their political, economic, social and cultural life, everything is strangled, in terms of the economy and everything else. And in terms of the impact on the Israeli citizens, it is insignificant when compared to the economic stranglehold both in Gaza and the West Bank. Certainly in Northern Ireland there’s attempts by certain politicians to make a sectarian atmosphere. We had, recently, mainly in response to a demonstration organised by the Irish Congress of Trade Unions in Belfast, during the assault on Gaza, in which we managed to mobilise over 5,000 people, which is a considerable number inside a city the size of Belfast, but shortly after that we had a Northern Ireland Friends of Israel created, and I think there’s a lot of orchestration and frankly the Israelis themselves through their Embassies will make life as difficult as they possibly can, for trade unions, within trade unions and publicly as well. I mean as soon as we had carried the resolution, it was a resolution carried from my own organisation Belfast Trades Council, and also from Derry Trades Council, making a number of demands on Israel and Palestine, but one of them was the boycott. As soon as that resolution was adopted, or those two resolutions were adopted, the Israelian ambassador to the UK set up a meeting with the Irish Congress of Trades Unions in Belfast, and his counterpart in Dublin did the same with our colleagues in the Republic, and you could see that they were very concerned, very agitated about anybody anywhere taking what you may regard as a moral stand in regard to what is happening Palestine. They don’t want to become international pariahs, and even though the economic impact may be small, I think the more important thing is that those demands are being made and people across the world are actually calling for a boycott of Israeli goods, and for divestment as well. So they are very sensitive to it, but they’re obviously masters as well of propaganda, they’re masters of a whole range of things, some of which I’ll not mention here. But even within our own organisations we meet up with some elements that local Zionists, or local people encouraged by authority, are trying to make life difficult for the trade unions that have adopted these positions in respect of Palestine. So the boycott campaign, in my union, and other unions people have resigned. I don’t want to denigrate religion but we have a bigger proportion of fundamentalist Christians, in our part of the world, and Christians, who are very very supportive of Israel, and all the rational argument and reasoning and pointing at facts will not convince them, will not convince them. So sometimes you just have to disregard them. One of the things, I think the boycott and divestment campaign, these things when they seem to be going slow, can take off when you’re not expecting them, but just to give an example, within the last week, in the Republic of Ireland, Sligo Council carried a resolution a while ago calling on the County Manager not to enter into any contract with Veolia. And the equivalent organisation in Galway, the City Council in Galway is calling for the same thing. So those are two municipal organisations in the Republic of Ireland where these issues are being raised, and in one of them there has been some success, but the County Manager makes the decision, the County Councillors have decided that they don’t want to enter any new contracts with Veolia because of their role in relation to the Light Rail aspect. The Irish Congress of Trades Unions has taken quite a clear position, but at the same time there is an inertia within the trade union movement, and that’s a problem in itself. There’s a natural inertia and resistance to doing things, especially if it’s going to create any conflict or internal conflict. So even within the Irish Congress, and Eamon will maybe mention it, we have been pressing the Executive to ensure that we progress the Conference resolutions that have been adopted, so that resolutions aren’t just adopted and put aside, they’re actually implemented. We have had a relaunch of our report on the delegation, in Belfast, it was launched by a Unionist Member of Parliament and a Sinn Fein Member of Parliament. We’ve relaunched that. There’s a conference which the Irish Congress of Trades Unions are organising in June of this year as well, and that’s part of the resolution to raise this issue as well. If it is just left it will just be another Conference resolution. And because this is a very difficult issue, I know for instance at the Irish Congress of Trades Unions conference in 2007 where the resolution was carried, one of the guests from the British TUC was encouraging some opposition to it. [...??...] So there’s issues that need to be developed. Some people are more convinced than others, we need that process to move along as well. I’ll just finish off there, and leave it to Eamon and to members of the audience to ask questions. [applause] Steve Farley: Eamon, you’ve got 5 minutes! Eamon McMahon: He stole all my points! Brian by the way is Deputy General Secretary of NIPSA, the Northern Ireland Public Service Alliance, which is the largest trade union in Northern Ireland, it’s the only union in Northern Ireland that’s a member of the Irish Congress. And having a Deputy General Secretary of a union coming here and participating, and being so committed to this particular case, I think it’s a very valuable thing and it’s a credit to Brian [applause] I’ll only stay on for a couple of minutes. The first is a kind of ethical point. I’ve heard people talk about apartheid and slow genocide that’s happening. But one thing that really strikes me if you think about the oppression of the Jewish people in the 30’s before the Holocaust and leading up to the Holocaust, and the oppression which is happening now, the Israeli Deputy Defense Minister threatened a holocaust on Gaza, a number of months. It was clear the holocaust in Gaza was planned, and it took place over the Christmas period. What’s different between that and what happened to the Jewish people in Germany is that this is happening in the eyes of the world, it’s very very public, and there’s no shame about this, it’s changing people’s attitudes and their ethical positioning and how they respond to atrocity, and in that sense the fact that this is on our TV screens and it’s happening and our governments aren’t protesting because they’re brutalised and we’re all brutalised by what’s happening, this is a personal view. One of the things that we’ve been successful at doing in the Irish trade union movement, the motion that was passed in 2007 and it came from Belfast Trades Council, Brian was one of the signatories in 2005, at the Irish Congress, and the Irish Trade Union Congress is the only trade union congress in Ireland and it represents all the unions in Ireland, North and South. The motion in 2005 called to campaign in solidarity with the Palestinian people. A number of us approached the Northern Ireland committee and asked why don’t we put this on the, deliver something in terms of this, and we asked them to set up Trade Union Friends of Palestine, and they did that. And Trade Union Friends of Palestine is now part of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions, we’re in there, and it’s still a struggle to get accepted within the organisation and in a sense they can look askance at us. But what we have found is that we have been in many ways pushing an open door. Because the leadership of the trade unions and certainly the grass roots members are overwhelmingly in support of the Palestinian people and overwhelmingly in support of initiatives we bring to them. So whenever we do bring forward initiatives like on the BDS day on the 30th of March when there was an international call to take part in Boycott Divestment and Sanctions, that was, we brought that to the Northern Ireland Committee of Congress, and they supported it. So we’ve found that working in the trade union movement is very very possible. We’ve brought forward resolutions, we’ve brought forward motions to the 2007 Congress. We had a very long and very strong motion, not just calling for Boycott Divestment and Sanctions, but condemning the European Euro-Med and asking the Irish government to take a different position. That motion was passed overwhelmingly by Congress. It’s the strongest motion in the Western world, apart from Cosatu, calling for Boycott Divestment and Sanctions. We’ve carried out a number of other actions, and the campaign now is to deliver a very physical boycott campaign. That’s the challenge for us at the present time. I’d like to thank you all for your time. [applause] Greg: we’re now, having struggled with the technology for the last half hour, we’re going to be talking with the International Officer of COSATU, Bongani Masuku, who is a strong supporter of the Palestinian cause as is COSATU, the Congress of South African Trade Unions. As soon as Nahida tells me that the phone is ringing I’ll come over, just shout at me Nahida, but the Congress of South African Trade Unions was formed in 1985 during the very bitter fight against the apartheid regime, and their formation was really the decisive event in the 1980s, and when they speak about Palestine they know what they’re talking about when they use the word “apartheid”. It’s not a piece of propaganda, it’s not rhetoric, they know what apartheid is. And so it’s quite significant, and they’re also still quite a militant federation. I hope we’ll succeed in getting through. Nahida: it’s not connected. Hello. Hello. We lost it. I’ll try again. I could hear him. Steve: we’ll take questions Greg: Hello Bongani, are you there? we’re struggling with the technology, can you hold on the line. Ok, plug it in. Nahida: well we can’t hear anything. Greg: ok, just pull this out. I’m going to talk to you and tell the audience what you’re saying. Do you want to tell the audience how you see the importance of worker solidarity with Palestine, what Cosatu has done and what it plans on doing? Go ahead! Bongani:... Greg: Ok, I’m just going to repeat that. He’s saying, we know what apartheid is, we really know what we’re talking about on apartheid, and we say there is no place in the world that is a greater concentration of imperialist aggression than in the Middle East, and there is no racism more dramatic, no more dramatic example of apartheid today than the oppression experienced by the Palestinians in Palestine. Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying the role that Israel is playing in the Middle East is comparable to the role that Colombia is playing in Latin America, and that there cannot be any peace in the Middle East until Israel is compelled to obey international law. Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying that what the US is doing in its own aggressive imperialist conduct around the world is actually quite comparable to what Israel is doing, and the only way out of this situation is to strive for a world which is actually governed by international law, in which international law has force. Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying that anyone who’s actually been to Ramallah, or in the West Bank, will have experienced the pain that the Palestinian people are experiencing and they themselves will feel that pain, so it’s very important to have eyewitnesses to this brutality. Greg: Bongani, can you tell us a little bit about what Cosatu is doing and what you plan to do? Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying that Cosatu is firmly committed to the BDS strategy and it’s because of that that the Cosatu affiliate SATAWU, the South African Transport and Allied Workers Union, took the action that they took in February, and they plan to do more things like that, but they also have mass marches and they intend to develop the campaign, it’s not finished. Bongani:... Greg: In June they’re going to have a conference on international solidarity, not just about Palestine but dealing with Burma, with Cuba, and with other places, and Zimbabwe of course, and in response to the outcome of that conference they will be going to their Congress in September to try to finalise COSATU’s position. Bongani:... Greg: They’re working with the Palestine Solidarity Campaign in South Africa to try to spread this movement throughout the whole of Southern Africa to offer concrete solidarity with the Palestinian people. Greg: Bongani, I wonder if you might say what you want trade unionists around the world, such as the people in this room, to do. Bongani:... Greg: First thing is that everybody should commit themselves that they’re not going to buy or use products from Israel. [applause] Bongani:... Greg: Well, he’s saying that we have to refuse to handle goods going to Israel, and he is citing the example of the Liverpool dockers back in 1988 which he is calling a heroic example. [applause] Greg: thank you Bongani, what’s next? Bongani:... Greg: The third thing is that we must refuse to be intimidated by the Zionists who are mounting a campaign all over the world, for example he mentions next week in Geneva, the Durban II conference against racism where the United States and Israel have pulled out specifically over the question of Palestine. We can’t give in to that kind of bullying. Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying we must compel the European Union to subject Israel to the same scrutiny that other countries have to face. [applause] Bongani:... Greg: He’s saying we must apply the International Criminal Court to the crimes that Israel is committing, and he refers specifically to an initiative by Justice Goldstone, which he is saying we should be supporting. Which is an EU and UN initiative. A United Nations initiative. Goldstone is being appointed to investigate war crimes, Bongani is telling me. Bongani:... Greg: And he is saying finally that we have to tackle the double standards that some unions are showing in which they claim an equality between the colonizer and the colonized, and they try to treat the Israelis as an equal partner in this situation, but that’s not what it is. [applause] Bongani:... Greg: They try to portray – he’s talking about the situation in South Africa – that the Zionists try to portray the Israelis as victims, but it is actually the Occupation which is the source of the problem. Greg: ok, that’s great, thank you very very much for talking to us Bongani. [applause] Greg: ok, we’ll see you, bye bye. Greg: well a little bit dramatic, but that was Bongani, and he could hear me telling the story so if I got it wrong he would have told me. What I would just like to say to you, for those of you who don’t know, the Israelis ship their goods all over the world, and when this particular ship was loaded in Israel, was right in the middle of the invasion of Gaza. It sailed during the height of the invasion, and the bombardment, and it got to Durban, they knew in advance that it was coming, and this union said that they would not handle this ship. And then it got very complicated with another union and scabs and blah de blah. But the significance of what happened is not limited to whether they succeeded in scabbing the ship or not. That’s not what it’s about. What it’s about is that Cosatu, the union federation in South Africa, has put their weight behind it and they’re still talking about it now. And I expect it may happen again. [applause] Steve: we’ll open it up to questions. Norma Turner: I’m a health worker, and I’ve been to Gaza in March, and one of the things that I saw was the destruction of the Red Crescent Society and it seems to me that one of the demands to be made through the health workers unions is they support any war crimes investigation because that’s an obvious war crime, you’re not allowed in a massacre or in anything else to destroy the Red Crescent. So, in Gaza, the ambulance workers weren’t unionised there, I think that trade unionisation within Gaza would make it easier for unions here to make links and to support war crimes investigations if there was some unionisation there, so I’d like you to consider those questions. And just to our Irish comrades, I remember during the so-called Troubles in the North of Ireland, that UNISON again we used to argue within UNISON that we shouldn’t be recruiting within the North of Ireland because it was supporting the unionist position as opposed to general unions, so obviously within Ireland you’ve got a lot of examples of how supporting workers and at the same time fighting an imperialist struggle, actually conflicts. So if you can remember any of that experience, I’d like to hear some comments. Sameh: what was the question? Norma: about the unionisation Sameh: well in the Gaza Strip, there is no syndicate for the labourers, because everything has been destroyed. And maybe Hamas has its own system, Hamas is a country in the Gaza Strip, it has its own army, its own financial ministry, it’s a government, and I guess the union is part of the Ministry of Labour that is linked to Hamas, there is no unions. Greg: You should ask Manawel about that as well. Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: He’s saying that his union is working in the Gaza Strip at the moment, the name of his union. What has happened in Gaza is that Hamas took control of the premises of the syndicate. And within months, the Israeli army, the Israeli jets, totally destroyed these premises. (And I [Sameh] went there and I’ve seen that). Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: Our determination was strong at that time, and we have rented a small premises in which we are operating, especially the public service union and the health unit and it was a message to Hamas that we would be operating, we would be working under those circumstances. Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: Just before I came here, I have contacted some people in Gaza and we have sent them some money to continue renting these premises. Steve: Brian do you want to comment on the question about Ireland? Brian: Maybe it was a Nalgo union at the time, I think their policy was to campaign for a Declaration of Withdrawal by Britain, so they thought it would be contradictory to start organising, but when the unions came together you already had Cohse and Nupe in Northern Ireland, so Unison stayed. I need to be careful because I’m in a union which would be regarded as a competitor union so I’m not going to say much. Let me say, trade unions generally, with regard to anti-imperialism, within Northern Ireland certainly we’re a bit bloody optimists, but what trade unions were able to do, less successfully than what would have been necessary, they were able to focus in on, not so much what I would characterise as an anti-imperialist struggle, but focusing in on the question of rights, civil rights, democratic rights, the abuses of civil liberties, and I think however you characterise what is happening in Palestine, the Achilles heel in many ways of Israelis and the United States is their treatment of the Palestinian people in terms of their rights, their economic, social rights, their civil liberties, that’s what I think where they’re most vulnerable. So in that sense there are similarities, but I think you need to be careful. Eamon: I just want to add to, in relation to the unionisation of workers in Gaza, it was an issue, there was concern about Islamic trade unions and we did say this in our report, this report from the Irish Congress contains a detailed account between a member of the PGFTU in the public sector union offices in Gaza, where we heard about the loss of your offices and your property and your radio in the case of Hamas attacks, that’s something that the Palestinian Centre for Human Rights also would condemn as well, and we have condemned it. We also met with the Deputy Prime Minister, Dr. Basem Naim, who also gave us their response to the PGFTU, so it’s a very detailed account of both positions in this document. There’s a couple of copies there but you can get it on the website, and it also contains our policy positions. So it’s at www.ictu.ie . The last point I wanted to make was in terms of the attack on Gaza, I think the statement from the PGFTU in relation to that slaughter, that statement that “We are all Gazans” by the PGFTU, where they unequivocally condemned the Israeli genocide and unequivocally called on the international trade union movement to support Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions, I thought that was a wonderful statement, and reference to that statement is included in the motion that is going to go to our ICTU biennial delegate conference, and it’s one that we applaud. X: I wanted to ask, really it’s to Manawel, about the position of Palestinians in Israel, it’s a complicated issue, but would you, as the PGFTU, feel you had the right to protect them? Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: For more than 60 years of the existence of Israel, their condition is miserable. Israelis are trying to create laws to make it quite difficult for people inside Israel, and I have told you about the trains earlier in my speech. Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: The racist Lieberman is pushing on enforcing racial laws against those people living in Israel, the national law, a law which is to be like faithful, Palestinians have to show they are faithful. And Israel is a Jewish country, not for our people, Palestinians, Arabs, Christians, no, they want it to be pure Jewish. Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: From long ago Arabs, Muslims, Christians and Jewish were living in peace and coexistence. Until this moment in Arab countries you can find Christians, Muslims and all others. Manawel: [in Arabic] Sameh: I cannot even defend those people living in East Jerusalem who are working for Israeli owners. So they come for us to complain and to get help from other solicitors. Steve Farley: the food hasn’t arrived yet. Michael Kalmanovitz: Just in reference to the brother from South Africa who mentioned the Durban Review conference happening in Geneva, just now in fact. I just wanted to mention that the Palestinian Boycott National Committee is calling an Israel Review conference precisely to deal with the question of Israeli apartheid. My own organisation, the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Organisation, is part of that organising, and we’re absolutely there to spell out that Israel is an apartheid state and we oppose it. Steve Farley: there will be further debate and discussion later this afternoon. Just an observation from this morning. Manawel talked about not only the military force that’s used but the economic force used against them, to force Palestinian people into poverty is another way of breaking the spirit of the people. We should never underestimate that, to actually undermine the structure of a society by creating poverty is a way of weakening that society from within. I think this type of conference, I think you mentioned that Brian is Deputy General Secretary of NIPSA, my own Deputy General Secretary Hugh Lanning who will be speaking this afternoon, we had a COSATU representative speaking, I think it does show that both the senior officials in organisations but also the rank and file members of trade unions are behind the Palestinian people and are trying to make the plight of the Palestinian people an issue that needs to be dealt with particularly by Western societies. And I think when we meet in places like this, with all due respect to Deputy General Secretaries and to COSATU, it’s about taking this message back to our workplaces, back to our friends and colleagues, back to our organisations, in order to say, first hand we’ve heard from international speakers from Palestine, from Sameh, with the graphic pictures from Palestine, we’ve seen them, and we know what goes on, and it is important to put those arguments out there to the people we work with and live with and see, in order that they can understand the plight of the Palestinian people, because it’s only through grass roots pressure that we can get to the position that Manawel talked about this morning, which is, support the boycott of Israeli produce in order to stop the persecution of the Palestinian people and see a solution that is acceptable for self-determination of Palestine and to the Palestinian people themselves. Greg: We’d like to run two workshops, can we have some indication of interest in each? The question of direct contact between trade unionists and their counterparts in Palestine is actually key to getting action, and I’m very glad that Kevin Brown has come. Pia: Can I ask, I’d like to get together with others from Unison? Greg: people in Unison gravitate to Pia. Unite look for Danny. UCU to Gill.
|